THE INTERVIEW: Tommy Barone

Real Haters sits down with Tommy Barone III ‘25 to talk turkeys, illiberalism, and whether or not all press is good press.

Tommy Barone III ’25 is the outgoing chair of the Harvard Crimson’s editorial board. He has interned for ABC News, the National Zoning Atlas, and the Harvard Public Opinion Project. In November, he was elected as one of thirty-two 2025 U.S. Rhodes Scholars. At Harvard, he studies “America’s illiberal turn,” and in his free time, which he does not have, he enjoys [INSERT HOBBIES HERE]. Tommy claims to be the occasional target of Real Haters and a ranking member of the Slanjo List, charges which we dispute. His LinkedIn bio mentions that he hails from the New York City Metropolitan Area, by which he means, New Jersey. Two weeks ago, he requested to be interviewed by Real Haters, and we agreed.

This interview was conducted in Faro Cafe on a very cold afternoon during reading week. The transcript has been edited and condensed for clarity.

HG: What are your thoughts on Conclave? Remember that your portrayal in this article hinges entirely on your review of future Best Picture winner Conclave (2024).

TB3: First of all, you can’t scare me with threats about my portrayal in this interview. If I cared about how I looked in Real Haters, I wouldn’t be here. With that in mind — as a Catholic American man who likes good political dramas, I was ooh-ing and ah-ing all the way through Conclave. I was loving it. But when I took a step back — and this was an opinion which only deepened with time — I did, unfortunately, realize that the film had one of the dumbest plots I’d ever seen.

HG: :(

And I know that you’re interviewing here, but I’m sure the readers are curious — does the plot bother you? Are you irritated by the lack of realism involved in, first, a cardinal nearly becoming pope but then having his ascent spoiled by the discovery of his illicit child by way of a nun who had, in fact, surreptitiously been brought to the conclave — and the coincidence of that coinciding with a priest being caught siphoning money from the church and using it to bribe other cardinals in advance of the conclave? And not only those two incidents, but then a terrorist attack not only breaching the Vatican, but specifically the Sistine Chapel right as Ralph Fiennes stares mournfully up at the ceiling? And finally, a total nobody of a cardinal being chosen, and not only being chosen, but subsequently being revealed to be intersex in a total non-sequitur? Does any of that bother you??

I was there to watch middle-aged divas in red dresses reveal their little schemes. I had an amazing time.

I see.

Let’s talk your biography. You are Tommy Barone III. Do you intend to name your son Tommy Barone IV?

This is a good question. I’d actually like to set the record straight about this. I am Tommy Barone the Third in an Italian American, middle class, father-honoring way. My grandfather was Thomas; my father was Thomas; I am Thomas. But if I were to have a son, my son would be a Tommy Barone the Fourth in an ‘insufferable, legacy, didn’t-do-it-on-his-own, Harvard student’ type of way. So I’ve been worrying about saddling my hypothetical son with the mantle. It just doesn’t fly, not in today’s culture. That being said, when I expressed this concern to my father, he did tell me that he would never speak to me again if I failed to name my son after him.

If you were to have only daughters — would you name your daughter ‘Tommy Barone IV’?

No, no. At that point, I think it’s a good excuse to break the chain.

We took questions from Real Haters subscribers. A 6’5 Environmental Studies concentrator asks: You have spoken publicly about your Italian heritage; do you celebrate Columbus Day?

No comment.

[Editor’s Note: This interview was conducted before the UHC shooter was revealed to be an Italian American Ivy-Leaguer with great hair.]

A 5’2 Classics concentrator in Lowell — we have a very height-diverse readership — asks: Your giant blue eyes are frightening to small children; what do you plan to do about them?

Well, I will begin by saying that my eyes are actually green. ‘Luminous green’ is the way I might even describe them. A lot of people have been comparing me to Elphaba. And I don’t have any comment on that, but I’m holding space for it.

Very current.

Actually, when I was born my eyes were blue, and then they changed color. So I do contain multitudes in that way, as well. But in terms of what I plan to do about that — I’ll just say that I wear a lot of green, and there’s a reason for that.

What does the world need more — the Crimson Editorial Board, or the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law?

I’ve always believed in the primacy of ideas over material causes, right? It’s sort of my disciplinary standpoint. Opinion sections prefigure public policy. I believe it was Keynes who said that politicians and policy-makers believe themselves to be driving change, when they really are servants of a long-dead poet.

So your predecessors, in the grand scheme of things, got the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law passed. And your work today will influence future groundbreaking legislation.

In the immortal words of Claudine Gay — I can’t comment on my predecessors.

You were recently accepted to grad school-

That’s not true. I still have to be accepted to grad school. I won funding for grad school.

Okay. After that, you plan to pursue a career in journalism. Did you ever consider getting a real job, or did Tommy Barone always dream of being unemployed?

My mother has been asking me the same thing. I was actually choosing between journalism and academia because the job prospects are just so strong in both. In the end, I just thought to myself — what profession would just let me yap the most? The answer was ‘journalism.’

Speaking of getting into things, or lack thereof — you keep finding yourself on the receiving end of misfortune these days. And we keep reading about it in the Crimson. Why is that?

We keep the editorial and news boards separate as a matter of principle. I really couldn’t comment on ‘why’ — you’d have to ask the news journalists why they’re so interested in talking to me. But I believe in holding power to account, and if I can use my voice to make change, I will.

‘Power’ includes Currier grad students, and the finals clubs-

Especially the Fly and A.D. Clubs.

How much did you pay for your Royale ticket?

$65. Then I had to buy a ticket to the Game On party, and pay for my Ubers on each leg of the trip. In the end, the night ran me up three figures.

How would you contextualize your attempted entry into the Royale party with, as you put it in your Twitter bio, “America’s illiberal turn”? Do you feel that it is representative of a national trend away from populism, aka, the Game On party?

The crisis of illiberalism is, in some ways, symptomatic of a failure of our slow, deliberative processes of change, and liberal democracy not being up to the moment when we’re facing threats that feel more urgent than ever. In a certain way, the line at Royale was a powerful analogy for the circumstances that we face in society. More broadly, it’s an environment where people I know — whom I believe to be fundamentally decent — are, by virtue of their conditions, experiencing the everyday concerns that any reasonable person would fear and seek to avoid. They were driven to undercut the process — to subvert it, to move around it, and in so doing to create a result that is worse for almost everyone.

The Crimson just inaugurated its 152nd Guard. Do you feel that they will do a good job confronting the turkey menace that threatens our campus?

I think the incoming executives will do an excellent job discharging the high responsibilities of their offices.

Speaking of Twitter bios. After you got the Rhodes, how long did it take for you to add it to your Twitter bio?

Fewer than 72 hours; greater than 24. Maybe forty-eight hours. A modest period.

What is the worst cafe in the Square?

Pavement. The worst drinks and worst ambiance. Always crowded.

Not Faro?

No.

So you don’t care about fire safety, then.

I love Faro. But I might even characterize that controversy as yet another instance of the failures of well intended, classical lowercase-L liberal governance.

You play a peripheral role in Harvard’s ongoing debates about intellectual vitality. Where does Real Haters fit into that conversation?

It… is a publication that exists. It is a voice in the conversation. Voices on campus are a good thing. And that’s what intellectual vitality is all about.

Are there voices on campus that you think shouldn’t exist?

I can’t comment on that.

Now that you’re done chairing the Ed Board, what do you plan to do with all your newfound free time?

I plan to work out every once in a while. I want to discover what food insensitivity has been causing me so much pain this semester. I’m doing a self-guided tour through prestige fiction right now, of the last fifty or sixty years. This summer, I left off on a Murakami book. Most importantly, you can find me at Grendel’s.

What’s your go-to Grendel’s drink?

I’ve really been on a mulled wine kick lately. Once this interview drops, I’m probably going to start a trend. Buy your mulled wine while you still can, people, because it’s gonna get sold out. Otherwise, my go-to drink is a gin and tonic — with Hendrick’s, specifically. This summer, I had a real affection for French 75, but my dad called it effeminate, so we’ll see if that lasts.

You asked for an interview to, as you put it to me, ‘clear your name.’ Do you feel you have done so, or is there anything else you would like to add?

I don’t think the past year of my life offers any assertions about my ability to avoid PR crises. But what they say is — and I think this is a good aphorism — all press is good press. Why do you think I offered you this interview? And I might just add, for an applied case: I wrote an op-ed at the end of last semester that received much attention, none of it favorable, online. But what many might not know about that episode in my PR journey over the last year is that — I was the one who first tweeted it out, because…

All press is good press.

All press is good press.